On behalf of the Center for Southeast Asian Studies (CSEAS) and as the editor of the Kyoto Review of Southeast Asia, Pavin Chachavalpongpun, professor at CSEAS, interviewed Dr. Kao Kim Hourn, ASEAN’s Secretary-General, on the topic, “Is ASEAN Still Relevant?” The interview was conducted on 19 December 2024 during which time Dr. Kao was invited to give a lecture on the said topic at CSEAS.
Below is the transcript of the interview from 19th December, 2024 with questions asked by Pavin Chachavalpongpun –
Coming back to Myanmar, this is a very important issue. ASEAN’s Five-Point Consensus which called for an immediate cessation of violence, inclusive national dialogue, and humanitarian assistance, once again echoed the ASEAN consensus. Stakeholders believed that ASEAN should play a role in resolving the Myanmar issue and we think that it was important. We have released some statements, and those stakeholders expressed their support for ASEAN centrality. Returning to your question, whether we require a centrality to address the challenges that we have, I think we do. This is because when we talk about this central role, we need to have a consensus amid convergences. It is required to engage on issues of core interests to us. ASEAN has long exercised its central role in managing different issues, from the issue of nuclear proliferation through the Southeast Asian Nuclear-Weapon-Free Zone Treaty (SEANWFZ), to the ASEAN Outlook on the Indo-Pacific (AOIP). Despite the fact that there are many Indo-Pacific strategies, our partners came out to support the AOIP and jointly issued statements. These are not just statements however, but a concrete cooperation, particularly in the four areas of maritime, economy, connectivity, and the Sustainable Development Goals (SDGs). But these are not confined areas of cooperation. There are other areas of cooperation too, such as defence.
As for the ASEAN Community Vision 2025, the four new strategic plans which we expect to complete and to be ready for adoption by our leaders during the Malaysian chairmanship. This is a vision which carries a powerful message that ASEAN is having its own pathway, roadmap and way forward. And it will continue to build its own community for the people of ASEAN. So, it is not something that we are chasing after someone else. But it is a very clear vision and important for us in projecting a very positive, forward looking strategic vision. As for the Vision 2045, this is the first time in our history that we drew up a 20-year vision. Initially, people said that maybe it was too long. But I think at the end of the day we agreed that this was the way forward for us. And at the same time, it means us being very transparent, very open and inclusive, meaning that this is what we do and what we can be to our partners and friends. Come and work with us. We wish to invite them to work with us. We are looking into the future in terms of how we want to engage with all the great/major powers in this region and around the world.
The other issue that is very important is the TAC, signed in 1976. We have been together for 48 years in working with our external parties. Beyond ASEAN, we have countries that are now subscribing to the norms and values of us. Those countries ratified with us. If you look at all the countries acceded to TAC now, they cover all the continents and regions of the world.
Dr. Kao: Thank you very much. It is really a very important issue for ASEAN when it comes to identity. In the charter, we talk about building an ASEAN identity—what we call the building of our socio-cultural community. We refer quite often to the people of ASEAN. This does not only reflect in the charter but also in many other key documents of ASEAN. Making the region belong to the people is to make sure that they feel they are part of ASEAN. On the one hand, ASEAN embraces diversity. ASEAN respects diversity. Yet, we also have to promote the common identity, or the commonality of ASEAN members. And that is through what we do as a regional grouping. Now we have the ASEAN anthem, being played more often than before, especially before the start of official functions. It was composed just right after the launch of the chapter. And there was a competition. The Thai group won the contest with beautiful lyrics sending out a very powerful and clear message. I hope this practice of playing the ASEAN anthem will continue. When we received the letter of credence from ambassadors from other countries to ASEAN (106 countries), we also played the ASEAN anthem.
Back to the topic of ASEAN identity, we have done a lot of work in this area, but we still have a long way to go. What we need to do is to make sure we are doing this for the benefit of the people of ASEAN. As a region, we know that if we go alone, separately ten nations (soon to be 11), we cannot attract all the foreign investment, rather than we do collectively. Last year alone, ASEAN attracted 228.9 billion dollars of foreign investment, only second to the United States. But among the developing economies, we were the number one. We are working to become a single market and production base, as stipulated in the charter. We have to convey this to the people of ASEAN, collectively to be able to attract investment. With investment, we can create jobs for the people. Second, people in ASEAN can in the ASEAN zone travel without visa. We always thought about Europe’s Schengen visa. We do not have that sort, but we have our own version. ASEAN travellers could just book flights, and travel. So, this is the mobility of the people. ASEAN’s intra-tourism is growing. I am saying this with the ASEAN spirit of cooperation. Beyond all these are many other projects, activities, and initiatives to promote the ASEAN identity. But certainly, we need to do a lot more. We still ten separate nations. We need projects to promote identity constantly. We have other things like ASEAN lanes at the airports. We must promote visibility of ASEAN, as in flag that is displayed at public buildings and at embassies of ASEAN countries around the world. We also have many countries in our TAC community. We have an ASEAN community in Tokyo which is doing a lot of work to promote ASEAN visibility and reach out to citizens of the host government. We also need to raise an awareness of ASEAN and promote it as an identity around the world. We have what is called the ASEAN Center, such as in Tokyo, Seoul, Beijing, and Washington DC. Just last month, we had a new one in Canberra, Australia. So, I think this is coming up quite well. For example, in Japan, we have 10 ASEAN members’ embassies which promote a lot of activities. In China, the ASEAN activities are significant because there are more budgets, more programs, and more activities. This can be viewed in part as an effort to raise an awareness. We go beyond the people-to-people linkages, to cover the business community, in all areas, from trade, investment, tourism, culture, and education.
Dr. Kao: The ASEAN Secretariat is an institution that was set up by the member states. And this institution has evolved considerably over an extended period of time. I remember people used to say that what they do was to get some coffee. It was like coffee shop as I heard it from previous Secretary-Generals. They did not have a lot of staff when they started. I think it is normal as an institution that started from a very humble beginning, and then evolving over time. Today, the Secretariat is a full functioning institution with resources—financial and talents, to serve the interests of the member states. We receive support from our external partners to make sure that the work we do and all the things that we are mandated to do would be able to move forward.
The institution has changed over time from the beginning, and I think there was a big change back in 1992. Today, we have the Secretary-General who functions constantly. We have over 400 regular staff and more than 200 project staff. We have officials who think about ASEAN, who work on ASEAN, who promote ASEAN, who undertake various activities 24 hours—basically, every day and every year. They provide services to support us in meetings and support the Chair. The Secretariat is a long-term institutionalization to make sure that the decisions of the member states are made, that they will be monitored and carried out. It has to be able to engage with our external partners and sustain the engagement. We continue to invest in the Secretary-General because we have the annual budget with the contribution from the members states. By making the annual contribution to the Secretary-General, member states put a lot of confidence and trust in this institution. This is an area that we need to do more to make sure that we have a stronger Secretary-General because at the end the day, the Secretary-General serves the interests of the states and the people of ASEAN. That is why I think we need to invest in endowing the resources to enhance capacity building and talents of the Secretariat and the Secretary-General. Thank you very much.
Biography of Dr. Kao Kim Hourn
Dr. Kao Kim Hourn’s career has focused on strengthening Cambodia’s international relations, particularly in ASEAN, driving policy advocacy and promoting research, education, and development. Dr. Kao had served as a two-term Minister Delegate attached to the Prime Minister of the Kingdom of Cambodia, from 2013 to 2022. He has authored dozens of books and articles on Cambodia and ASEAN.
Dr. Kao is a Member of the Supreme National Economic Council, a Senior Fellow at the Jeffrey Cheah Institute on Southeast Asia, and a Member of the Global Council of The Asia Society. He serves as a Member of the Board of Directors for the Cambodian Institute for Cooperation and Peace and the Worldwide Support for Development.
With the mission of providing education to the disadvantaged Cambodian youths, Dr. Kao established The University of Cambodia in 2003 and continued to serve as the university president until he stepped down in October 2022.
For his services to Cambodia, Dr. Kao received the Royal Order of Cambodia, the Royal Order of Sowathara, and the Grand Order of National Merit, among others. He was also awarded an Honorary Doctor of Public Service from Ohio University in the United States, in 2007, and an Honorary Doctorate in Literature from the Kalinga Institute of Industrial Technology in India, in 2014. In addition, Dr. Kao received an Honorary Doctorate in Political Science from the Busan University of Foreign Studies, in the Republic of Korea, in June 2023, in recognition of his work and contribution to ASEAN. In recognition of Dr. Kao’s achievements in the field of political science and international affairs, he was conferred the Honorary Title of “Guest Professor” by Zhengzhou University, in Henan Province, the People’s Republic of China, on 15 October 2023. Dr. Kao Kim Hourn was conferred an Honourable Member of the International Advisory Board of the Institute of ASEAN Studies at the University of Oxford, United Kingdom, on 2 November 2023. Most recently, Dr. Kao was conferred the title of “Specially Invited Professor” by Hiroshima University, Japan, on 21 May 2024.
Dr. Kao started his career with the work in the think tank in Cambodia, dedicated to ASEAN and international affairs, after his return from his studies in the United States, in January 1993. He later joined the Royal Government of Cambodia where he had served, from August 2001 to August 2013, in a variety of capacities, including a post as Secretary of State of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and International Cooperation, for two terms, from 2004 to 2013.
Dr. Kao completed Bachelor of Arts in Asian Studies from Baylor University, Master of Arts in Political Science and Master of Arts in International Studies from Ohio University, and Doctor of Philosophy in Political Science from the University of Hawaii at Manoa.
He is married with two adult children who live in Phnom Penh.
https://asean.org/what-we-do/secretary-general-of-asean/
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